Bruno:
before youcontinue reading (what you forgot in total amnesia<G> ) a
question:
You wrote among others:
*"...Note that with high concentrated extract of Salvia Divinorum, people
can "suffer" (or "enjoy") a total amnesia, where you forget not just your
name and memories of life, but you forget even what is a person, what is
space, what is time. Yet you remain conscious...."*
How do you define *"conscious"* for a state without *ANY *memory working in
your mindset? How can you *'understand'* anything (to become 'aware' of?) -
You may experience a connectionless and meaningless *wirwar *emerging in
(literally) senseless randomity - not even recognizing that it is a
'view', a 'sound', or 'idea' until you 'deveop' *SOME *connections (right or
wrong).
Then you have a 'perceived (solipsist) world to be 'aware of'.
Now in that you can continue reading. But what will you read?...
Regards (hopefully with retained memory, so I still remember you...)
John M
On Tue, Mar 17, 2009 at 2:05 PM, Bruno Marchal <marchal.domain.name.hidden> wrote:
>
> On 16 Mar 2009, at 13:31, Quentin Anciaux wrote:
>
> Hi Bruno,
>
> 2009/3/15 Bruno Marchal <marchal.domain.name.hidden>
>
>>
>>
>> Hi Günther,
>>
>> >
>> > Hi Bruno,
>> >
>> > thanks for your interesting answer, I have some questions though.
>> >
>> >> course, as I said, this will depend of what you mean by "you". In
>> >> case
>> >> you accept the idea of surviving with amnesia, you can even get to a
>> >> state where you "know" you are immortal, because your immortality
>> >> is a
>> >> "past event".
>> >
>> >
>> > I would equate total amnesia with death (we've been through this
>> > before,
>> > Stathis has written about this, if I remember correctly).
>>
>>
>> I remember Quentin identifying himself with his memory, and very
>> logically, identifying total amnesia with death.
>> It is a complex matter. Total amnesia concern only some form of
>> declarative knowledge, you cannot loss your "procedural memory",
>> because it is part of ... arithmetic, and common to all elementary
>> knowers.
>>
>>
> Well I agree that in total amnesia thought experiment... well the amnesia
> is not total... the subject still knows his former language and other
> knowledge... except all knowledges/memories about *who* he was is lost. And
> in this sense IF in one minute I lose these memories about my current ME,
> then my current ME is dead for all practical purpose. And IF mwi and/or comp
> is true then there must exists a moment which is a successor of current ME
> without the current ME memories being lost... so I should end up in this
> state and not in the state where my identity was erased because like I can't
> be where I'm dead... I can't be where I'm not. The 'I' which is referred is
> the one with memories, the one without cannot meaningfully say he is a
> successor of me now, except if he sees like in real world "total" amnesia
> case that his body was mine and causally connected to mine. But in comp
> sense this is not meaningful... If my mind can be copied and transferred in
> a "metal" body, this metal body is not causally connected to my biological
> body... but that mind is a continuation of current me.
>
> So in this sense, if you say that it is possible that all successor moment
> to a moment could lead to a "total" amnesia, then QI is false... or
> tautologically true because it means you are everyone (ie: no one). But for
> all practical purpose current ME would be dead.
>
>
>
>
>
> Hmmm...
> I ask you, and others, this question. What is the probability "now", that
> you will find yourself in Washington and Moscow the 24 december 2009, when
> you are annihilated in Brussels, now, (17 March 2009) and reconstituted in
> both Moscow and Washington the 18 March 2009, say)? The problem is that the
> reconstitution machine did dysfunction in Washington, so that, from the 18
> March 2009 up to the 20 Augustus 2009 you (the you in Washington) suffered a
> "total amnesia". And then, "you" recovered slowly and progressively from
> that through adequate medication up to a total recall, the 23 December (and
> none of yous did move from W or M).
>
> Note that with high concentrated extract of Salvia Divinorum, people can
> "suffer" (or "enjoy") a total amnesia, where you forget not just your name
> and memories of life, but you forget even what is a person, what is space,
> what is time. Yet you remain conscious. Life appears as a dream, that you
> recall vaguely, and then forget, and then you forget you did that dream. Yet
> "you" come back. (See the reports, I don't encourage its consumption, but
> anyone interested by consciousness can be interested by such reports).
>
>
>
>
>
> I'll continue to read the rest of the mail.
>
>
>
> OK.
>
> Regards,
>
> Bruno
>
> http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/
>
>
>
>
> >
>
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Received on Tue Mar 17 2009 - 14:37:49 PDT