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From: H J Ruhl <HalRuhl.domain.name.hidden>

Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2002 23:28:22 -0800

Dear Russell:

snip

*> >
*

*> > I do not see that at all. Why does it need a history? All it needs is
*

*> the
*

*> > capability of finding a next state.
*

*>
*

*>It doesn't need the capacity to find the next state. If it has that
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*>capacity, then the history is computable.
*

I said "capability of finding a next state". I did not indicate how it

found such a next state. It could for example do so at random.

*>It is a poor assumption to
*

*>assume that the universe is deterministic (history computable from
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*>initial state).
*

That is part of what I am trying to say. How can one definitely associate

a particular history [parsed particular string] with a particular universe

unless one can make such a deterministic computation of the successive

segments from their individual prior segment?

*>Histories are any description unfolding with time, whatever that
*

*>happens to be. Time appears to be necessary for consiousness.
*

Why must there be an unfolding. A universe can be just a sequence of

completely random states.

I see universes as a sequence of states where each transition is partially

determined randomly. How much random content effects the properties of a

universe. But there is no unique identifiable history for such a

universe. Each of its states can be considered to be an initial state.

*> >
*

*> > That was not my point. The initial state of a universe is not
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*> computable -
*

*> > it just was. The point is the method of association of any history with a
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*> > particular universe.
*

*> >
*

*>
*

*>My point is that any history just is. However, those that are
*

*>computable from a simple initial state are dense in a large subset of
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*>such histories (subset proportional to 2^{-C}, where C is the
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*>complexity of the initial state), so we should expect a random sample
*

*>to select a history that is approximately a computable outcome from a
*

*>simple initial state.
*

I see the degree of random content in the finding of the next state as

having a uniform distribution and any degree of random content can belong

to an infinite number of different universes.

*> > As to your example how would you parse it into segments each describing a
*

*> > state of the universe? The universe may be doing so and thus computing
*

*> > Omega and not know it. This as I understand it is possible for non
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*> halting
*

*> > computers since no selection to compute Omega was made.
*

*>
*

*>Good point - perhaps Omega is a bad example. It is possible that an
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*>algorithm exists for computing the binary expansion of Omega, its just
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*>that you can never prove that it does. However, there are uncountably
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*>infinite number of binary strings for which no algorithm
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*>exists. Choose any one of these.
*

I do not see that the absence of an algorithm for computing the complete

string is relevant to the mechanism of computing a segment from the prior

segment.

Yours

Hal

Received on Tue Jan 22 2002 - 20:31:05 PST

Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2002 23:28:22 -0800

Dear Russell:

snip

I said "capability of finding a next state". I did not indicate how it

found such a next state. It could for example do so at random.

That is part of what I am trying to say. How can one definitely associate

a particular history [parsed particular string] with a particular universe

unless one can make such a deterministic computation of the successive

segments from their individual prior segment?

Why must there be an unfolding. A universe can be just a sequence of

completely random states.

I see universes as a sequence of states where each transition is partially

determined randomly. How much random content effects the properties of a

universe. But there is no unique identifiable history for such a

universe. Each of its states can be considered to be an initial state.

I see the degree of random content in the finding of the next state as

having a uniform distribution and any degree of random content can belong

to an infinite number of different universes.

I do not see that the absence of an algorithm for computing the complete

string is relevant to the mechanism of computing a segment from the prior

segment.

Yours

Hal

Received on Tue Jan 22 2002 - 20:31:05 PST

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