Günther Greindl wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> Bruno, do you still keep a notion of causality and the likes in
> platonia? I have collected these snips from some recent posts:
>
> Brent Meeker wrote:
>
> >But is causality an implementation detail? There seems to be an
> >implicit
> >assumption that digitally represented states form a sequence just
> >because there
> >is a rule that defines that sequence, but in fact all digital (and
> >other)
> >sequences depend on causal chains.
>
> Kory wrote:
>
> > I have an intuition that causality
> >(or its logical equivalent in Platonia) is somehow important for
> >consciousness. You argue that the the slide from Fully-Functional
> >Alice to Lucky Alice (or Fully-Functional Firefox to Lucky Firefox)
> >indicates that there's something wrong with this idea. However, you
> >have an intuition that order is somehow important for consciousness.
>
> But we must realise that causality is a concept that is deeply related
> (cognitively, in humans) to time and physical change.
>
> But both time and space _emerge_ only from the inside view (1st person
> or 1st person shareable) in the sum over all computations.
>
> In Platonia (viewed, for the time being, ludicrously and impossibly,
> from the outside) - there is no notion of time, space, sequentiality,
> before and after.
>
> The very notion of causation must be one that arises only in the inside
> view, as a "succession" of consistent patterns.
I agree. But what is it about the patterns that creates a succession as viewed
from "the inside"? And how do we know that this does not obtain in the
projection of the MGA?
Brent
>
> In a sense, order (shareable histories) must arise from the Platonic
> Eternal Mess (chaos) -> somehow along the lines of self-organization maybe:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-organization#Self-organization_in_mathematics_and_computer_science
>
> In this sense, the computations would "assemble themselves" to
> "consistent histories".
>
> Bruno said:
> >Even
> >in Platonia consciousness does not supervene on description of the
> >computation, even if those description are 100% precise and correct
>
> Hmm, I understand the difference between description and computation in
> maths and logic, and also in real world, but I do not know if this still
> makes sense in Platonia -> viewed from the acausal perspective outlined
> above. Well maybe in the sense that in some histories there will be
> platonic descriptions that are not conscious.
>
> But in other histories those descriptions will be computations and
> conscious.
>
> Cheers,
> Günther
>
>
>
>
> >
>
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Received on Sun Nov 30 2008 - 14:11:01 PST